I've had the pleasure of interviewing Bill Walton, the legendary Trail Blazer, Hall of Famer and television analyst, enough times to know that you don't really "interview" him in the traditional sense of the word. Sure, you can ask Walton questions, but he ultimately decides what direction he's going to take the conversation, which works well when you've lived the kind of life he has.
Between playing for John Wooden at UCLA, being one of the Grateful Dead's most devoted fans, leading the Trail Blazers to their one and only NBA championship to winning another with the Celtics as the NBA's best sixth man, calling NBA and basketball games and having his body break down on him, only to be saved by the powers of modern medicine, Walton has no shortage of stories, many of which he shares in his new book "Back From The Dead: Searching For The Sound, Finding The Light And Throwing It Down."
Walton will be in Portland on Saturday, April 9 at noon for a book signing at Powell's on Burnside. And last week, I spoke with Walton on the phone from Los Angeles to discuss writing "Back From The Dead" and the reaction to it, continuing to support The Grateful Dead in their newest incarnation and what he looks for in a musical act, the reestablishment of diplomatic relations between the United States and Cuba, regret (which I would argue is misplaced) over his body giving out before he was able to help Portland win another championship, the death of Cortez, his beloved dog, his final trip to visit Maurice Lucas, rooting for the Oregon Ducks and the Golden State Warriors' quest for history. You can read the interview below, perhaps while you're waiting in line at Powell's this weekend.
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So what kind of feedback have you gotten since the release of "Back From The Dead"? It seems like the reviews have been positive.
Bill Walton: Casey, I have been staggered, overwhelmed and awestruck by what has happened in the last week of my life. I’ve had a blessed life, and it’s not been without innumerable problems, but what’s gone down in this last week with what Simon & Schuster, with what the NBA, with what ESPN has done and now so many other media giants, powers and outlets have done in terms of helping to tell and share this story, a story of success and failure, hope and despair and life and death. To see the completely changed world that we live in today, the online world, the connected world, the global economy that we live in and the power of the gigantic company Simon & Schuster, NBA, ESPN, oh my gosh.
When we were at the NBA store during the initial launch, I was there for five hours. They played the Grateful Dead throughout the entire store for five hours and never repeated a song with one exception at the very end, they played Black Muddy River (twice). I kept thinking to myself, "They have not repeated a single song in five hours," and then they played Black Muddy River, which they can play all the time as far as I’m concerned. Everybody was coming through the line, I’m asking, "Where you from?" and they’re saying China, South Korea, Australia, Argentina, Mexico, Brazil, Africa, Middle East, Israel, Germany, Paris, London, Barcelona, Rome. "How’d you hear about this event?" "Ah, it was on my Instagram account this morning," "I saw it on Twitter, I’m one of the NBA’s 21 million Twitter followers." How different it is from the days when Ramrod from the Grateful Dead would mail me the tapes from the show the day before and I would get them a week or so later and I would take then down to the Memorial Coliseum. Rick Schonley, Bill’s son who was just kind of hanging around and doing whatever needed to be done in those days, because we were a startup, an expansion franchise. He was a Deadhead too, Rick was, and he would take the tapes and he would play them over the PA throughout the Memorial Coliseum for everyone to hear in the hour before the game time and it was just fantastic. I knew once the music came on that we were never going to lose.
I’m glad you brought up The Dead, which I knew you would. I was having a conversation the other day with your friend, fellow Deadhead and our Vice President of Basketball Communications Jim Taylor about an incarnation of the band continuing to tour despite all of the farewell shows last summer. I thought he might be offended that they were going to continue touring, though he had the opposite reaction, saying he’d keep going to shows as long as they keep playing music.
Bill Walton: No fans wanted them to stop. So when we were there at the very end — I went to all five of the farewell shows, two in Santa Clara, three in Chicago — I wrote a book forward for the "Fare Thee Well" picture book collection that Jay Blakesburg produced and I titled that forward "Nine Days That Changed The World." And at the end of those nine days we were all sitting around right there in Soldier Field after two straight nights of 80,000-plus fans at Levi’s Stadium in Santa Clara, three straight nights of 70,000-plus at Soldier Field, all five shows record-setting attendance. We’re all sitting around laughing and having a good time and I looked at the band and I said, "Look out there! Look at all those people out there and look at how happy they are! Look at how happy you guys are, look at how much money everybody just made. How could you possibly think about stopping?" We’re sad that Phil (Lesh) has gone in a different direction, he’s still making fantastic music and great business and everything, but Phil is 76 years old now. The road is a hard and tough place, for anybody, and these guys have been at it for 51 years and I’ve been with them for 49 of those years, so I’m the luckiest guy in the world.
Anyone who has spent a couple seasons traveling with an NBA team knows the toll that kind of lifestyle can take on a person.
Bill Walton: Just look at the tour Bruce Springsteen is on. I got the honor of seeing him just a week ago. Spectacular, a message of hope. There’s far too many people in the world selling fear and death. The guys who I like — Springsteen, Dylan, Grateful Dead, Neil Young, Jimmy Cliff, John Fogerty, Carlos Santana, Rolling Stones, Eagles, John Lennon, Jackson Browne — these guys are all selling hope. I’m with those guys. When you no longer believe and you’re having your doubt and hesitation and indecision, just think back to one week ago today: Obama went to Cuba and three days later, the Rolling Stones showed up. What could be better? Who would have ever thought? And I get to Oregon next week, so how lucky am I?
I know a lot of people are excited about your upcoming appearance at Powell’s in support of the book. I’ve had numerous people ask me for details.
Bill Walton: I’m a very proud Oregonian. I wish I could have done more. I wish it would have lasted forever and I just wished that we could live one endless championship, but that’s sadly not the way it turned out.
I don’t know Bill, having delivered the one and only championship, I don’t think you have a whole lot of cause for regret in that regard.
Bill Walton: Well, so here’s the thing on that Casey. I grew up under the auspices of John Wooden. So much of what I know is always traced back to him. Much like the Grateful Dead, much like Dylan, Neil Young and all these great singers and songwriters and performers, musicians, they have a song for everything, and Wooden had a mantra for everything, he had a maxim for everything. The mantra for this one is, "Never measure yourself by what you have done, but rather, by what you could or should have been able to do." We were good enough, we had the talent. We had one of the great teams in the history of basketball, but I was unable to sustain because of the structural congenital defects in my feet, because of the limitations in my muscular skeletal system. I just could not play enough. The more I played, the more I ground my feet up into dust and I ultimately have today two fused ankles. It’s all one bone from my knee down on both sides. But I’m doing great because I don’t have the pain and I’m not grinding my teeth at night, no medication. I’ve never been busier, never been happier, haven’t been this healthy since I was 13 years old. So things are fantastic and I never thought I would be pain-free, I never thought that I would be happy in love, and I am both of those. I’m the luckiest guy in the world.
That’s great to hear. And I’m sure you don’t need me to tell you this, but you’re not really responsible for your body breaking down. There’s only so much we can do, and you fought through a lot, so I don’t think you owe anyone an apology.
I take my responsibilities very seriously. The people in Oregon, they always treated me better than I deserved. I just wish I could have reciprocated the same way, I wish I could have helped Cortez, our dog. He passed a week ago.
That’s terrible. I was going to ask about Cortez.
Bill Walton: Cortez, he just passed a week ago, he died in my arms. He was the greatest dog in the history of the world. He was my service dog, he made me happy. He rescued me and I could not do the same for him. It’s just so sad and I’ve had a really, really hard time ever since.
I’m very sorry to hear that. We had to put down both of our dogs last summer. I think I held on to them too long for my own selfish reasons when I should have been thinking about what was best for them.
Bill Walton: That’s the same story of the NBA and the Blazers, what we’re all trying to do to make this all work. All the business lessons that we get from the people that built the Blazers, none more important than Bill Schonely. Bill Schonely, the most important man in the history of the franchise, because he delivered the message, he made people believe that this was bigger, better and more important than it was, or is. His commitment to selling the dream and the hope of being a part of something really special is the dream that I bought into as a young boy myself listening to Chick Hearn. These legendaries figures that are associated with just one franchise, Bill Schonely, Johnny Most, Chick Hearn, are just absolutely incredible. The fact that Bill is still going strong and still making us believe.
To think of all the guys who worked so hard. The visionary risk-taking of Harry Glickman and Herman Sarkowsky and Larry Weinberg and how this phenomenal franchise with the record-setting performances. Eighteen years of selling out every single game, incredible sponsorship support and the Blazermaniacs and how these guys just sacrificed so much to make it happen. And how great it is, the stability of the franchise. In, what 45, 46 years, they’ve only had three owners, Sarkowsky, Weinberg and now Paul Allen. We’re the luckiest guys on earth.
We certainly are. It’s a beautiful day here in Oregon, by the way. Mid-70’s, not a cloud in the sky.
Bill Walton: Oh man, I’m in Los Angeles. It’s freezing here.
Getting back to the response to your book, what do you think it is about your story that resonates so much with people? You’ve led a remarkable life and it seems like people can’t get enough of hearing about it.
Bill Walton: I’ve been so lucky in that I’ve been a part of these great teams over a very long period of time. The choices that I’ve made in my life — the choice to go to UCLA and play for John Wooden, the choice to join the NBA, the choice to come to Portland, the choice to go to Boston and the most unlikely choices of all, to try and become a television commentator and broadcaster. I’m a life-long stutterer. How many other 6-11, red-headed, big nose, freckle face, nerdy-looking, stuttering Deadheads are out there in the broadcast field? And then I’ve been a Deadhead for 49 years. There’s all these different groups, all these different demographics that I’ve been a part of. I love the team, I love the people, I love the stories, I love the big moment, I love being on that court, I love being in the gym, I love being right in the mix. To have this chance to be able to come and share, because when I consume information, when I read a book or watch a show or go to a concert, I want to be challenged, I want to think, I want to laugh, I want to cry and I want to be driven to care about why this is important and what this means. And that has transcended every aspect of my life. That comes from my parents, my early coaches, my heroes and my role models, all those different people.
My life, I’m a book guy, I love to read and I am who I am because of those books that I’ve read over the course of now 63 years. I’m still reading, I’m just finishing up David Axelrod’s “Believer,” which is a phenomenal book. All these different moments in my life, which I’ve tried to capture the epiphanic ones where I’m standing there at the fork in the road and I’m one person, then something happens and I make that choice left or right, which way I’m going to go, and I’m a different person. When I turned this book in to Simon & Schuster they said "Bill, it’s too long." They were very much like John Wooden, they just said "No, no, no," all the time.
They say, "Bill, it’s too long," and I say, "Well, how long is it?"
"Well Bill, we only wanted 120,000 words."
"What’s a 120,000 words?’ I’m 63 years old, I’ve had a long life, there have been a lot of different things. How many words did I give you?"
"Bill, you gave us 285,000 words."
So we had a lot of battles over the editing process, but I will say my relationship with Simon & Schuster is turning out very much the way it was with John Wooden, who I didn’t understand when I played for it. It wasn’t until I moved on and joined the NBA and came to Portland (that I understood). Now with Simon & Schuster I see the job that they’re doing, the quality product that they put out and their ability to help tell the story and all the different media opportunities that they’ve created for me here. So I’m just hoping that one day, one person will read this book and say, "You know what, if Bill Walton can do this, if Bill Walton can have this kind of life, what’s to keep me from having the kind of life that I want?" As I sit here in this hotel room in Los Angeles, I look through all the different artwork that Mike DuBois was able to contribute — all the poster art — and the brand new stuff that he put there in the end of the book where the acknowledgement page goes, the dedication page at the beginning, what he did in terms of all the little artwork pieces, what he did with the cover and what he did with the photo insert section and all the little trimmings, it’s just absolutely fantastic. And then I get to the very last page, these last two pages, what I want for what’s next. And I start that chapter, which is entitled "I Can See Clearly Now. I Can’t Get Enough. Is It The End Or The Beginning?" I am so looking forward to what’s next for me, I have been at this for far too long.
I’m so lucky Casey in that I get that chance, the chance to keep going, because I’ve gotten all better, and not everybody gets better. Cause I remember the greatest Trail Blazer of them all, Maurice Lucas. He and I went down at the same time. We would spend hours on the phone, he at his home in Portland, me on the floor in San Diego. We were trying to convince the other guy that they were better off than we were. Oh my gosh it was tough, it was brutal. And then I remember when my new and great friend, Pat Kilkenny, took me up to Oregon on his plane. Pat, out of the kindness and goodness of his heart — as fine a human being as you’ll ever know — Pat took me on his plane from San Diego, basically from my hospital bed, to see Maurice who was in the closing stages. Pat flew me up there, went over to see Maurice and I hadn’t seen him in a while though we had talked a lot. I was waiting for him to come out from his bedroom, I was in the kitchen with Pam and Lori — my wife Lori was there — my older brother Bruce was also there. We were waiting for Maurice and when he came out we were all sort of taken aback about how much he had changed physically. He had lost a tremendous amount of weight, was very, very thin and did not have that huge, muscular, powerful body that we always associated with Maurice, the greatest Blazer of them all. And his hair had turned all white and he had sort of a couple of days of stubble on his face. I looked at him and I said "Wow, you look just like Bill Russell." Bill Russell is my favorite player ever, right? I said it as a compliment, "You look just like Bill Russell," and Maurice looked at me and he snarled "That’s the worst thing anybody has ever said."
Losing Cortez and losing Maurice and losing Jack Ramsay and my first coach Rocky passed away last August. John Wooden and Maurice passed within four months of each other. You think of these guys who are so omnipresent, so powerful, so indestructible, they can do anything. And then they go down and it’s just, oh man. Our challenge now is to pick it up and to carry on and to carry on. As I dreamed all these stories from reading as a child, reading to this very day. That "Believer" book, I don’t know if you’ve read it or not, it’s absolutely over the top brilliant. David Axelrod is so very, very similar to David Halberstam, his writing style and skill and use of the language. It was overwhelming. And then Obama goes to Cuba and the Rolling Stones are there three days later, what could be better? I’m a believer.
Have you booked your trip to Cuba yet?
Bill Walton: No I have not. I would have gone from New York but I was just too sick and I had too many things to do. Plus I’m busier than ever. Business if fantastic for me. Things are great, I’m the luckiest guy in the world. To show you Casey how far things have come, I now root for Notre Dame and the Oregon Ducks.
That’s got to be tough for a Bruin like yourself.
Bill Walton: I’m a different person today and hopefully I’m a better person. All the mistakes and all the failures, they’re not good when they’re happening, but they teach you life’s greatest lessons. The way that Notre Dame and Oregon, particularly the Oregon Ducks, I got to see them a lot this year. I just love the way they play and I really, really wish they had won and made it all the way and won the championship. They were good enough. They were good enough and when they were on their game, nobody could beat them, but they did not get it done. And I’ve been there and I know how painful and how permanent the disappointments are. As an Oregonian and a member of the Conference Of Champions and as a good friend of Dana Altman and a huge supporter of everything Phil Knight and Pat Kilkenny do, I wanted them to keep going because it is really fun and I know the value of what a great team does for a community. I lived that, never more so than with the Portland Trail Blazers. Oh my gosh, what a team, what a community, what a moment. How old are you Casey?
I’m 35, turn 36 next month.
Bill Walton: We have three children older than you.
I think Luke and I are pretty close in age if I’m not mistaken.
Bill Walton: Luke just had his 36th birthday yesterday.
He was at Arizona when I was at Oregon. I won’t say I remember him fondly, but I do remember him. And on the topic of your son, I was listening to the excerpt from the book in which you describe the time the league got together the 50 Greatest Players in NBA History and Michael Jordan and Wilt Chamberlain took turns arguing who the greatest player actually was. That got me thinking about all of the former players who have come out recently saying the Golden State Warriors, who your son coaches for, couldn’t do what they’re doing now back in their day. What do you think about that notion?
Bill Walton: The NBA has never been better. Anybody who doesn’t think that, just come and spend a day with me on this book tour. What the NBA has been able to do in terms of delivering the message and the inclusiveness of everybody being so totally tuned in and the record-setting revenues, the record-setting attendance, the record viewership, it’s staggering what it has become. While I work for ESPN, I don’t live in ESPN’s universe where everything has to be ranked, where everything is the best or the worst. I learn from the past, but I dream about the future. I don’t get involved in this ranking, rating or comparing, I just enjoy it.
What the Warriors have now, that’s what we had. What Steph Curry is today is what Larry Bird used to be, is what John Wooden used to be. These remarkable performers who just epitomized perfection and personified what it means to be a great leader, a great teammate, a great human being. While I am a Blazer and a Bruin and a Celtic, I am also now a proud, loyal and grateful Warrior of Golden State. Even though our teams are involved in a lot of the records at stake right now, I want what’s best for Luke Walton and I love the way the Warriors play. I want them to win every game, I want them to set every record and I want them to win the championship again and I want Steph Curry to be a unanimous MVP. That’s the kind of player, that’s the kind of person, that’s the kind of team, that’s the kind of culture, all the things I believe in, they represent that. It’s fantastic. I was a part of something like that years ago, I know how great that is. It didn’t last forever for me, I would love for it to last forever for our son Luke, who is named after the greatest Blazer ever Maurice Lucas. Every time, every time Luke was in a critical juncture in his life, Maurice would just show up and stand in the corner and make sure that everything turned out just right.
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Bill Walton will be signing copies of his new book, "Back From The Dead," at Powell's this Saturday. Click here for more information on the event.